On a good day I'm mesmorised and thoroughly enjoy the wonderous journeys we've ventured on recently regarding championship belts, an area that has largely been ignored in the past. Understandably so, because titles were of little importance to wrestling fans in the post war years.
It was a real eye opener to me when Ruslan discovered Mountevans champions wearing belts that pre-dated the ones most of us associate with the Mountevans era, Alan Colbeck's even pre-dating the formation of Joint Promotions. On Morrell shows, which is significant.
Colbeck's 1950 Mountevans belt.
The commonly considered Mountevans Belt.
I was just as amazed when he found early 20th century belts worn by late 20th century wrestlers.
But then there are things I can't get my head round.
I can't believe that any post war promoter awarded belts outright for anyone to keep. These were the same promoters that argued about petrol money and the distance from Wigan to Barnsley.
I'm uneasy with a description of a real Mountevans belt and the ones we associated with the Mountevans champions. Why is the 1950 belt the real one? Who owned that/those belt(s)? It's hard to believe it was Mountevans. In 1947 he said he would award belts. I don't believe that meant that he would personally provide them. There is no evidence of him having any interest in wrestling. He was just a figurehead coaxed into the role by Morrell.
It was Morrell who wrote the Mountevans rules, Morrell who was the driving force behind the creation of Joint Promotions, and Morrell who bought the commonly considered Mountevans belts. When he retired he attempted to retrieve them all but was not entirely successful.
How could a wrestler "retire" a belt? Unless he owned it himself. Possible with the independents and maybe a Joint regional title, but not a Joint Mountevans title I wouldn't have thought.
As I said earlier, Joint Promotions (Mountevans) British titles are the only ones with any lineage or continuity. Occasionally a regional title has a bit of continuity. But when it comes to the independents,you'll be looking for consistency and continuity like a needle in a haystack. A Giant Haystacks. (But Ruslan did make a good comeback when I first said it).
Wrestling used to be simple.
So yeah, Beresford, Morell, and Relwyskow owned all existing belts historical and those of the modern era. There are plenty images of Steve Clements with 1910 Peter Gotz's Lonsdale Belt.
What happened to their belts when Tony St.Clair (British Heavyweight Champion), Mark Rocco (World Heavy Middleweight Champion), Brian Maxine (British Middleweight Champion) and Johnny Saint (World Lightweight Champion) left Joint Promotions in the early 1980's and started wrestling for independent promotions, yet were still billed as holding the titles that they had when they were with Joint Promotions? Did they have any belts with them when they were at shows with the independent promotions and if so, what belts did they have?
When travel wasn't as speedy as it is now there was probably an unwritten agreement amongst the Northern promoters to keep the vast majority of the belts in the North so they could all get their regular share of championship bouts. An occasional week in the south from each of the various belt holders over the calendar year would have almost certainly been arranged to keep Dale Martin sweet.
This is yet another fascinating aspect to the "sport" we all love, the champions, championships, titles and belts.
I thought we had established (years ago) that the original holders of the Mountevans belts were all men who could actually wrestle, and by wrestle, I mean actually beat other men, in a gym match/behind closed doors match. Billy Joyce was supposed to have held on to the belt until someone could actually beat him (and that was Billy Robinson).
I totally agree with Ron and others that these were marketing tools, to add some colour and flavour to a bill, to draw punters in. Some of them appear to be a case of someone simply purchasing a belt and announcing yourself as the champ (Count Bartelli?), others didn't even seem to have an actual belt ("Southern Area"), and how did Brian Maxine and Mike Marino hold on to those belts for so long??
I, for one, really enjoy Ruslan's relentless efforts to find out which belt belonged to which promoter. Did the wrestlers take the belt home, or did the promoter or referee bring them to the venue, as was put forward already.
We all know it was scripted entertainment, but we also know that some of these men were skilled exponents of wrestling and especially submission wrestling. The politics of the belts and who got them and who didn't (and why) are just as interesting, to me at least, as to what went on in the ring.
The "Northern Powerhouse", the majority of belt holders being northern wrestlers, Norman Morrell pulling the strings along with De Relwyskow, Wright, Best, Beresford. Only Dale Martin in the south?
just curious, could you have got a good price down at local pawn brokers for one
Hack said "Wrestling used to be simple"
I think that the paying punters when they started were simple. I must have been,
The photo of George Busfield with belt, Bernard Murray was the loser on that occasion ( and many other times).
Murray was too good a servant to Morrell, including training upcoming stars .
And their main purpose.......A Marketing tool.......Looked good in an age where wrestlers seldom spoke on the Microphone.
I bet no wrestler ever took one home unless he was a most trusted servant of the promotion.
It does seem that Dale Martins were not permitted to have the heavyweight champion
The Belts are a new dimension here on Heritage.
Hack, very good question Real (not Madrid in this case) v Morell's. I will try to answer this one. Yes it's a fact that Mount Evans himself promised the belts. But looks like the first belts were produced in 1950 and awarded to Colbeck and Busfield. Baldwin got his belt only in 1952. Originally it was advertised that committee doen't recognize any claimants as champions instead the eliminations in all weight classes have to determine the champion, the year was 1950. Around the same time we have Dale/Martin and his Arena Gold Belts, apparently they didn't care for Mount Evans/Morell initiative. Anyways original belts were in used throughout all 50's and it does look like Joyce held the original belt during his first reign. In the early 1960's Morell will order new set of belts and those will look totally different to the original belts. Notably artist who created new belts design was inspired by the old 1909-10 Lord Lonsdale Belts.
also there's a chance that Baldwin simply purchased Mount Evans Belt from Norman Morell, and that's why Morell decided to create new belts. That was a common practice of wrestler buying a belt from promoter, some belts for some wrestlers meant a lot. Baldwin was champion of Britain, first under Mount Evans Rules had a belt symbolic of that so yeah his emotion about that specific trophy would be very understandable.
retiring the belt...that's an old tradition which goes all the way back to Teddy Lowe champion from the 1860's Golden Era of Catch Pro Wrestling. I think it is very possible that after being awarded the title in 1958 Billy Joyce was given the original belt (previously held by Baldwin), but I also understand that it didn't last long since, there's no images of Joyce with it, all we have is images of Baldwin with that famous belt.
Looks like Colbeck and Baldwin weren't the only people who were given real Mount Evans Belts, Geo Busfield, another Yorkshire man was given the same honor, in featherweight class.
I do consider the discovery of Lord Mount Evans Belts of Colbeck and Baldwin important fact in history of titles, or at least trophies which represented the most prestigious title there was - British Championship.
Close up photo of real Mount Evans Belt.
You can see belts came from the same mold, the difference is Baldwin's belt is actually massive, when Colbeck's perfectly fits the lightweight champion.
Hack, I tried to identify the belt Colbeck is wearing on your photo, but have to admit, I failed all my attempts brought zero results. Here's the photos of Colbeck and Baldwin with their Lord Mount Evans Silver Belts, the real, the original ones.
I honestly believe that a lot of the wrestlers weren't trusted with the belts and the road/ring manager brought with him, the belts were similar and let's be honest nobody really looked at them. So unless you were trusted I believe you only had the belt when you came to the ring