WAS MIKE MARINO OVER-RATED?

Always have to say about Mike, he didn't "do it" particularly for me, but served the game well and brought on many star names: including Wayne Bridges & Mal Sanders so worthy of respect

Thanks Hack, a draw with a credible world champion is a good result.

According to the Lou Thesz tribute on this site Marino drew with Lou at Hanley on 23rd December, 1957. The source was Ray Plunkett.

Here are the details of the televised matches that Ost mentions, note that it gives you the original TV Times billed line up at the bottom.

25/5/63, Wembley, 1.20-2.40

Mick McManus (Southern area welterweight champion) (2) v Jackie Pallo (1)

Mike Marino (2) v Ski Hi Lee (1)

Steve Logan (2) v Steve Veidor (1)

Sid Cooper (2) v Zolton Boscik (1)

Johnny Kwango (2) v Keith Williams (1)

This was the annual FA Cup Final day spectacular, billed in the TV Times as "the show of the year". The billed line-up was McManus v Pallo, Clayton Thomson v Ezzard Hart, Leon Fortuna v Jim Breaks and Lindy Caulder (Lightweight and welterweight champion of the West Indies) v Pete Szakacs.

That is an interesting point Ost? The televised matches bore little resemblance to the ones that were billed to appear that day, wonder why they made the changes and, as you say, why two Paul Lincoln wrestlers appeared?

One thing that I think is interesting (you may have discussed this already) is this:

May 25, 1963 - a Televised show from Wembley on FA Cup final day.

Mike Marino defeated Sky Hi Lee 2-1. Now at the time both of these men worked for Paul Lincoln. Before and after this one-off. Did DM feel they needed bigger names for the Cup final show? Or did another match fall through. The answer is probably on the site, but I just think it's interesting and shows you the power of being a big name.

Marino had last appeared on TV in May of 1961, and wouldn't appear again until May of 1966.

Still the Wayne Bridgeses of this world are leaning tight-lippedly across the flaps of their bars refusing to share any info with nutter punters like us.

If only they were to know that they would nudge closer to immortality by sharing their wealth of experieces with us Nice nutters.

"actual evidence" ... Saxonwolf is spot on again in this game of smoke and mirrors.

We run the risk of believing articles written with great authority in 1968 about what did, or probably didn't, happen in the fifties.

The late fifties are very very under-reported. At least at that time. It was all based on reminiscences ten years later. Vague reminiscences. Reminiscences distorted to suit all and sundry.

Did we know that when the great Lou Thesz came to wrestle in the UK in 1957, Mike Marino was one of the men he faced?

Can we see if we can find actual evidence of this?

"... But it was to be Marino's year and fresh from a great battle with world heavyweight champion Lou Thesz at Hanley, Marino travelled to Aberdeen to meet Demitre, and came home with the title. ..."

Back to the Golden Boy.

Today is the anniversary of the death of Mike Marino.

Main Mask

You say Ct Bartelli should have retired.

Do you know how exciting it was for me in 1972 when he came south AND signed for me AND had a chat with me.

To agree with you I would have to erase my happiness.

And then he got in the ring. Old, yes. Stiff, a bit. But he OWNED the ring. His opponent just worked around him

Magic.

Please, Main Mask, don't.

A few comments comparing Marino and Bartelli. I do think that Marino at 59 was more credible than Bartelli at 59.

I have just read the Mike Marino's biography in John Lister's book 'Have a Good Week … Till Next Week'. A couple of quotes from it are 'on the British circuit he quickly made his name as a highly skilled technical grappler, working out in the gyms with the likes of Bert Assirati and Billy Robinson. Johnny Kincaid recalls that Marino produced a more credible wrestling base style 'he was a wrestler's wrestler. He liked to wrestle straight and his moves were very feasible'. Marty Jones recalls that Marino didn't use his legitimate skills to take advantage of younger grapplers 'he was what I think of as a great technical wrestler, he could make anyone look good and he wanted you to look good'.

I think that Mike Marino is just spoken too highly of by other wrestlers for him not to have been good enough to warrant his position as a champion, at his peak. I must admit that when I first saw him in 1977 I was not too impressed but I now know that he was 56 then. Like Mick McManus and Count Bartelli, he was allowed to keep his title in the 1970's, even though they were all in their fifties. I think that we should blame the promotors for that that, not Mike Marino.

Mike Marino and his amazing knowledge of all the holds and throws. His technical perfection remained until the very end. I think he brought Superstar Mal Sanders into the grappling game. Mike Marino, a wrestling legend.

Agree Anglo and I remember the fiction they wrote about Carl Reginsky. Born in England actually and had a scar they said was from a duel in Germany , but it was a night club incident.

Thanks Hack.

Weren't those old articles so beautifully written. They reveal almost nothing and most of any detail in what they do say we can now determine to have been tosh. I think even the writer forgot himself as his 33-y-o- Mike would have been just 20 when winning his European title in Paris.

No opponents are named, no promoters are named. Was his wife Italian? I rather thought not. The Italian childhood also sounds a bit dodgy - but just confirmed to the causal reader and fan what we wanted to believe. And he limited himself to two or three bouts a week....

And Primo Carnera is tagged on for no obvious reason. Love it.

1960 article

That's intriguing John. You write that his title defences fizzled out from 1972, and that's precisely when he started being the match-maker. So this clearly suited him.

Remember he did put himself in the limelight and had two bouts on the same evening at the Albert Hall. Both were 2-1 wins over McManus and then Big Daddy. He liked his bit of glory and perhaps didn't feel that merely defending his belts supplied this.

Johnny Kidd said today that one of the wrestlers he would have liked to wrestle was Mike Marino. He did also say there was no way that it could happen as he was a welterweight and Marino was fighting the likes of Bruno Elrington at the time. But Marino was a man he admired.